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MarkB

JohnnyB fitting K04 stg2 hybrids

JohnnyB wrote:
fitting my K04 stg2 hybrids this week then a quick trip to MRC for some injectors and a remap.


Many more details required please
JohnnyB

I had my engine out last week have only just seen this thread or I would of taken a load of photo's.

I managed to kill my 2nd set of K03's in 6 months so decided to go for STG2 Ko4 hybrids.

I have fitted my new turbos along with genuine Audi RS4 inlet pipes. I have also fitted a Bosch 044 fuel pump. Im off down to MRC next Wednesday to have my injectors fitted and to have it remapped again.

Ive changed the oil and filter again and my gearbox oil while I had the car in the workshop.

This won't be the last time the engine comes out as I want it around 650BHP eventually.

After Ive been to MRC I will be taking it for a power run on the rolling road will post the results. .
Adam

f*ck me you don't hang around
jimbo

why didnt you just go straight for the rs6 turbos if your after big power.
Paz

Nice one JohnnyB. post some pics dude!!
JohnnyB

jimbo wrote:
why didnt you just go straight for the rs6 turbos if your after big power.


Can't afford it at the moment. Going to look in to exactly what I want when I have saved up enough to do all the work I want to do for big power.

The K04's and associated parts/remap for this current upgrade will cost me in the region of 4000. This is with doing all the work myself barring having it live mapped and fitting the injectorsas the car can't be driven to MRC if I fit them myself.

Ive just moved to bigger premises and bought 2 new ramps could really of done with out my turbos going when they did.
JohnnyB

Paz wrote:
Nice one JohnnyB. post some pics dude!!


Unfortunately I did'nt take any pictures as I was on with it this time.
scoobydood

Aren't you worried that you have killed another set of k03's? Does this point to some other issue with the car that needs to be sorted before you abuse the k04s?

Or do you know why the k03s died?
JohnnyB

scoobydood wrote:
Aren't you worried that you have killed another set of k03's? Does this point to some other issue with the car that needs to be sorted before you abuse the k04s?

Or do you know why the k03s died?


Yeah my 2nd set of K03's were 2nd hand as the turbos went 2 weeks after I bought the car. Taking the engine in and out does'nt cost me any money and a 2nd hand set of turbos meant I could get my car back up and running for 150.

My car has no other problems with it, I change my oil and filter every 2000 miles and warm it up and let it cool down properly.
loomx

every 2000 miles! jebus!
JohnnyB

loomx wrote:
every 2000 miles! jebus!


Yeah might be a bit excessive

I changed it when I first got the car, then again the 1st time my turbos went, and now that I have changed my turbos again. All in 5500 miles, it wont be getting done again for around 5000 miles now.
JohnnyB

Right my engine is out again for the 3rd time in 8 months. This time I have been taking lots of photos of what is going on, and im fitting an MRC clutch and flywheel, MRC low compression headgaskets, new timing belt, XS power tubular manifolds, and 3" down pipes to replace my Milltek 200 CPSI cats. I will also be removing the centre box from my Milltek exhaust to make the car sound better.



I will add pictures of every stage of the job.
loomx

Sweet
jimbo

I THINK YOUR WORTHY OF YOUR OWN P+B THREAD  WHAT DO YOU RECKON MARK/DAVID
loomx

Common! build thread
MarkB

Happy for it to be a P&B thread

Plenty of pictures and info please
JohnnyB

No problems will certainly take lots of pictures and add lots of info.

This all came about due to one snapped stud in each turbo when I was removing my down pipes. To get these studs out needed the engine out to have them machined out of the turbos so as not to cause an even bigger disaster.






JohnnyB

I had some studs made out of 316 stainless steel which is corrosion resistant and extremely strong. Unlike the rubbish studs that came with the turbos.



JohnnyB

Once I removed the gearbox clutch and flywheel, it was easy to see the results of the clutch stinking on some hard launchs.





The clutch cover and flywheel faces are blue and the driven plate is also worn close to the rivet heads. All though its about knackered it did'nt slip and the pedal felt ok.
loomx

Damn! hate to think what mine looks like
JohnnyB

Yeah the launch on your avatar will verify that.
MarkB

JohnnyB wrote:





Those downpipes sure do look restrictive at the turbo outlet.

and your new turbo studs sure do look nice
JohnnyB

Thanks Mark they will be a lot better than the ones supplied with my turbos.


Last time my car was remapped at MRC the downpipes were creating to much back pressure, so when Doug tried to turn the boost up mt turbos started whining. So at the moment the car is mapped to max boost at 24 psi and back off to 22 psi. When Ive fitted all these bits its going back to MRC to have it remapped again to get the best out of it.



This is the worst part the cats
loomx

Hmm, this maybe thats what was happening with my K04s... The boost had recently been upped a bit and the dentist drill noise didnt come on until the 20ish psi area.
JohnnyB

What down pipes are you using?
James

3" XS power ones.
JohnnyB

Thats what Ive bought for mine for the time being till I get my twin 3" full system made.

They look a lot better flowing than the milltek ones I had on.
S4

Have you done anything to the  "XS power tubular manifolds" like put some braces on them?  some have said they can crack?



Darren
JohnnyB

Not yet im thinking of fitting a support bracket near the turbo's to help support the weight. When I fit them I will add some pictures of it.
JohnnyB

My car is now pretty well stripped.



Ive got the heads off and cleaned the faces and the block face ready for the new low compression headgaskets from MRC. Ive also checked the heads to make sure they are nice and flat. The bores are'nt worn and there's no cam and follower wear either. Pretty impressive for an engine that has done 156,000 miles.



JohnnyB

You can see the difference in thickness between the original gaskets and the low compression replacements.

JohnnyB

My engine is starting to look a little more complete again now. Ive re fitted the cylinder heads with compression drop head gaskets and new bolts. The bolts are tightened to 40nm then 60nm and then 2 90' turns of each bolt. Tightened in the correct sequence working outwards from the centre of the head.

My intercooler finally turned up yesterday after parcel force have had it at coventry for 2 weeks after I paid the customs duty, due to an error on there system.

My exhaust manifolds are on and fit well. I saw that confusion hunter had to modify his drivers side manifold to clear the compressor housing of the turbo. I have'nt come across this problem. I will add some pictures of what Ive been doing later today.
ScottR

Excellent progress.  Looking forward to seeing it on the rollers!
JohnnyB

Thanks Scott can't wait to get it back on the road. Once it's all built back up I need to do 800-1000 miles to bed my clutch in before I get it on the rollers. Engine should be going back in tomorrow and should be back on the road for Friday for an MOT then needs taxing as its all run out last week.
ScottR

At least the drive down to see Doug for the remap will take care of 400+ of those bedding in miles.
dubwhizz

ScottR wrote:
At least the drive down to see Doug for the remap will take care of 400+ of those bedding in miles.

only if he does it twice, york isn't that far up the country fella!!!

Matt
JohnnyB

Can't remember how far it was last time I went. According to route finder its 160 miles each way
JohnnyB

The new gaskets space the heads up a fair bit. The cambelt was tighter to refit as well.



The new flywheel is a lot lighter then the old dual mass unit. I had to swap the spigot bearing out of the old flywheel in to the new one by pressing it out then back in to the new one.



JohnnyB

Once the heads were back on with the cam covers all with new gaskets I fitted the timing belt. With the heads being spaced further up with the thicker head gaskets it made fitting the belt tighter than usual. Once fitted turned the engine over twice by hand to make sure the valve timing was correct. Everything was fine so started refitting the cambelt covers and the APR by pipe.

mikey-s

Tell me you're using a timing bar & crank pin?? I wouldn't use tippex to mark the timing, especially if you're tuning it!  
JohnnyB

It's been painted before I bought the car.
JohnnyB

Fitting the new flywheel and clutch was pretty straight forward. Once the spigot bearing was fitted in to the new flywheel.



New flywheel bolts were fitted and torqued to 60nm then 180' turn each. Using the proper Audi flywheel locking tool to prevent the engine turning.

JohnnyB

Then time to fit my new MRC 6 paddle clutch with RS4 cover and release bearing. The old clutch was a standard RS4 unit but was about worn out. Once the driven plate was aligned correctly using the Audi clutch alignment pin the new cover was fitted and torqued down 25nm.



James

Good work. It's coming along well.
loomx

Awesome detail! :thumbs: keep it up
mikeyquattro

Great info
Ghost

mikey-s wrote:
Tell me you're using a timing bar & crank pin?? I wouldn't use tippex to mark the timing, especially if you're tuning it!


JohnnyB wrote:
It's been painted before I bought the car.


You are joking right.
H8CAK

??
JohnnyB

Thanks guy's. Should have it up and running tomorow. Just waiting for a new clutch slave cylinder as the end of the rod is broken, must have been for a while but have noticed today as re fitting the engine.
Ghost

H8CAK wrote:
??


As in what what Mikey said:

mikey-s wrote:
Tell me you're using a timing bar & crank pin?? I wouldn't use tippex to mark the timing, especially if you're tuning it!  


Wasn't sure if Jonny was being dry ref his reply - painted with tippex before he bought the car.
jimbo

first thing minhea did with mine before we went out  to map it was to check the cam timing on vag com.
mikey-s

Johnny, fair enough. It just looks like fresh paint on the pulleys and timing covers, and it's surprising how far out the timing can be when it's done that way.

Nice build though!  
JohnnyB

Thanks Mikey picture will add some more pictures today.
JohnnyB

The metal coolant pipe that runs across the front of the sump was rotten so I ordered one from Audi as a preventetive measure. The pipe came and was wrong it was for a pre facelift car. The next day I received the correct one. Now its all fitted should save having any leaks in the near future.

This is the old one.



And the nice new one.

JohnnyB

The Toyo sport tubular manifolds fitted very well better than I expected after what I have read in other threads. I had to grind part of the bracket above the passenger side manifold to get it to fit, and modify a cap head bolt to resecure it to the head as its a tight fit.



Once my manifolds were on I refitted my K04 stg 2 hybrid turbos. These fit well on the new manifolds but I had to fit longer cap headed/allen bolts as the flanges on the manifolds are thicker than the Audi originals.



JohnnyB

Also I ordered genuine Audi gaskets for the manifolds, turbo to manifold sealing rings etc. The ones supplied with the manifolds look like cheap rubbish and are a composite type gasket not metal like the originals.

I have also replaced the vacuum pipes from the turbos up to the N75 as they looked about ready to expire. They were'nt cheap either but on an S4 what is.
JohnnyB

Next time to fit the down pipes that started this latest engine out job but gave me a good excuse for some more upgrades.

These also fit remarkably well considering what everyone has said about them. They did need a bit of a tweak here and there but nothing major.
These will be getting replaced in the not to distant future when I have my twin 3" full system and down pipes made.





The heatshields needed the brackets modifying on the manifolds to get them to fit back on again. But managed to get them nice and secure with a bit of faffing about.

JohnnyB

Now everything was built back up to the stage where I could refit my engine and gearbox back in to the car. Just gently ease it in.

MarkB

Can't wait to hear how you get on with the manifolds... and how long they last.

What sort of mileage do you do in the car?
JohnnyB

I use it every day Mark do they crack that quickly?

Will be replacing them with some MRC ones when funds permit. Will be building a 3.0 engine with bigger turbos next year.
MarkB

No idea how fast they crack.

If you can get it mapped in a way to keep the EGT's down they may never crack

But then performance won't be quite as good either...
H8CAK

Im very interested to see if anything happens with these mani's too. Id get a set if yours last a while?
JohnnyB

Right have just fired it up and the NS manifold is blowing sounds to be coming from cylinder no.4. Have had a look with bore scope all the nuts are tight and has new gaskets. So on Monday will be removing the engine again.

Starter motor sounds not to be disengaging from ring gear as well causing a horrible noise on start up. b*llocks!
jimbo

you must have the patience of a saint mate, i must come over and visit sometime, your only about half an hour away from mine.
JohnnyB

Thanks Jimbo yeah you should come over if you get chance. Last night I had enough need to have a day away from it then a fresh start on Monday. Will get it sorted before the rolling road day next weekend.
MarkB

JohnnyB wrote:
Right have just fired it up and the NS manifold is blowing sounds to be coming from cylinder no.4.


Did you check the manifold face was straight and true before you fitted it?

I've seen a warped cast exhaust manifold before, let alone a tubular one...
JohnnyB

To be honest Mark I did'nt. It looked flat but never put straight edge against it. Will post my findings when I get the engine back out on Monday. If its not flat I will have to get it machined. Drivers side is ok.

Need to get it sorted this week ready for next Saturday. Also Im getting pissed off with driving my Escort van 7 days a week. I can't wait to get my S4 back on the road.
MarkB

JohnnyB wrote:
To be honest Mark I did'nt. It looked flat but never put straight edge against it.


I must admit I probably wouldn't have either... I wasn't trying to look clever  Hindsight is a great thing

You would hope that a new part would be fine, but it shows a need to check everything very carefully before fitting.
JohnnyB

Yeah you would expect a new part to be ok. Made sure everything was clean and used genuine Audi gaskets to avoid this happening.

Will get it sorted though, need to see why starter motor is'nt disengaging fast enough either since I fitted the new flywheel. It will be really good when I get it sorted which makes it all worth while.
jimbo

rich had the same problem with a warped manifold flange
JohnnyB

Yeah sounds like what is wrong with mine I think. Will have to take it off and have it machined flat. Will probably do the drivers side one as well to be on the safe side.
JohnnyB

As suspected the passenger side manifold has a warped flange that mates to the head. Removed the engine again today for the 4th time in 8 months.

I have also removed the starter motor to see why its not dis engaging from the new flywheel fast enough causing an awful noise. Have ordered a new starter motor from Audi which will be here tomorrow.

The manifolds are off to the engineering company to be machined flat on the milling machine in the morning. I will add some pictures of my findings.
quattronutter

get them in a kiln first then get them faced
JohnnyB

Is this to allow for any more distortion? Not sure where I would find a kiln round where I am.
JohnnyB

Right have had the face of my manifolds machined flat today to sort out the blowing problem. Did'nt manage to find a Kiln to heat treat them first, but really need my car back on the road to get some miles on it before the rolling road day on Saturday. This will allow for sorting any minor problems I may experience.

I have also fitted a new starter motor today to solve the problem of it not disengaging from the flywheel fast enough on start up.
H8CAK

Back up and running for tomorrow then
MilkybarKid

Kiln would prob be to normalise the welds, and to get them closer to/past full running temp as they may distort further. Then you shouldnt have the same problems once its back up and running again.

Got to say though mate...
In the words of Monty Python & co.....



GET ON WITH IT!
JohnnyB

     Yeah will do hopefully be back on the road later today, need to get it MOT'd and taxed then its all done.
MarkB

How's the car feeling now with the freer flowing manifolds and downpipes??
GregorFuk

I have a feeling that your starter motor may have been fine.  I've seen the symptoms you've described a few times before and it's always turned out to be due to a weak battery.
JohnnyB

MarkB wrote:
How's the car feeling now with the freer flowing manifolds and downpipes??


Hi Mark it feels fast it produced 442bhp with 480ft/lb at the rolling road last weekend. Its only on 22 psi of boost at the moment though so plenty more to come.

I will be adding some more pictures of the build tomorrow. Such as the fitting of the intercooler and removing centre box out of my exhaust.

Its getting remapped again a week on Saturday. Viperbl is going to do it for me cant wait should be over 500bhp once its finished with a lot of torque.
JohnnyB

GregorFuk wrote:
I have a feeling that your starter motor may have been fine. I've seen the symptoms you've described a few times before and it's always turned out to be due to a weak battery.


When I took the starter motor back off the bottom dowl was broken and the end of the starter motor had been touching the flywheel slightly.

I replaced the dowl and fitted a replacement starter motor to be on the safe side as its a lot of work to change it.

Once reassembled its all ok.
H8CAK

So the mani's are all good now?
JohnnyB

Yeah the manifolds are fine now Ive had the flanges machined flat. They look really well made, especially for 125.
H8CAK

Ill be keeping an eye on this and if they are all good ill be making a purchase
JohnnyB

Cool will certainly keep you posted on how I get on with them. I forgot to measure the port size's as compared to the OE Audi ones, but they are considerably bigger. The outlet to the turbo is also quite a bit bigger.

Having changed the manifolds and removing the cats the turbos spool up a lot faster than before.

I used 4 tanks of fuel last weekend as I spent all weekend out playing in it.
MilkybarKid

4 tanks... thats the way it should be done!
loomx

I used 1/4 of tank today doing 20 miles....
H8CAK

JohnnyB wrote:
I used 4 tanks of fuel last weekend as I spent all weekend out playing in it.


Ouch  
JohnnyB

Can't beat it Ive been with out it for over a month. I love been out playing in it, best off early on a Sunday morning before all the Xsara Picasso's Nissan Micras etc get out there to ruin everything.
JohnnyB

Now the engine is back in the car with all the modifications that have been carried out the car drives really well. The turbos spool up a lot faster without having the cats in the down pipes and having the tubular manifolds.

Having the centre box removed from my Milltek exhaust and removing the cats has made the car sound a lot better as well. The standard Milltek was far to quiet. At Oulton Park trackday at the begining of December it was measured at 92 decibels so not offensive either.

I had the car dyno'ed at the SRS northern rolling road day and it produced 442bhp and 485lb/ft of torque. This was on the MRC map running 22psi of boost as the cats were restricting the turbos so Doug could'nt turn up the boost anymore.

Since then ViperBL has spent a full day mapping my car and it was a lot more powerfull would estimate over 500bhp and at least 550lb/ft of torque. It now peaks at 26psi and holds 24psi to the redline. The surging on part throttle has also been eliminated that it used to have.

I have some more pictures from the build to add of fitting my front mount and modifying the bumper which I will add soon.
MarkB

How many miles have you done with the manifolds fitted?

I'm interested to see how they look when the engine comes back out.
JohnnyB

Around 4000miles now with no problems. I will certainly add some pictures engine is coming back out this weekend.
MarkB

I wonder how much the better turbo spool was down to the manifolds or to the freer flowing de-cat'ed exhaust?
JohnnyB

The cats will make a big difference. The manifolds will help a lot to they are bigger diameter inlet and outlets than the standard ones.
MarkB

I think the cat removal will help spool. The larger manifold ports will help top end. IMO
JohnnyB

Here is my CX racing intercooler off ebay, just needs fitting.

JohnnyB

I fitted the intercooler after removing the air con fan and moving my Oil cooler. The PAS fluid cooler required some bending to get it to fit once the new intercooler was fitted. This has replaced my RS4 intercoolers.



I sat the intercooler on the transmission jack to get it all measured up to the car so it would sit correctly.
JohnnyB

I refitted the bar that holds the aircon fan on minus the fan to weld brackets to mount my intercooler. I bolted my 90' brackets to my intercooler and tack welded them to the cross bar in position on the car. I covered the intercooler and surrounding area with a piece of leather to prevent any damage from welding spatter.

loomx

looking good!
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